Rear electronic locker does not lock

[LS12FAST4U]

Just picked up the H3 about a month ago and I just had the opportunity to go off roading the other day. Found out that 4 hi lock and 4Lo work as normal. Now here is my problem. I tried to go up hill that had some rocks and loose sand but nothing crazy. I tried it in 4Lo WITH my rear locker engaged. The light was solid so I know it was engaged according to the instrument panel. I started to go up the hill and only made it maybe 10 feet and was stopped. A friend of mine was there watching and he said only my front tires were turning. The rear tires were just stopped. I backed up and tried again same exact thing. After that I put it back in 4 hi lock and everything was fine. Any idea why the instrument panel says it's engaged but it definitely wasn't?

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

if the rear tires were stopped, the problem is in your transfer case... though, as I've had a t-case apart, I'm not sure how you could be in 4 lo and not have power to the rear wheels.

A couple of guesses, the stepper motor didn't fully engage (though there is a switch to tell the computer it's engaged), the slider is stripped or missing a teflon bushing... I dunno, post up pictures when it's apart and educate me

 

[USMC_TOP]

Hook it up to something solid like a tree on a flat surface and I bet the rear wheels turn. It's skipping out on inclines


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[LS12FAST4U]

I changed fluids in the differentials and it definitely needed it but everything looked good. Tomorrow I will be changing the T case fluid. So you guys think it might be t case related? Only reason it seems weird is because it operates correctly in 4 hi and 4Lo without the locker on.

 

[USMC_TOP]

Rear tires turn in 4 lo without the locker engaged?


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[LS12FAST4U]

Yeah. Turns fine. I climbed a couple hills without the locker. Makes me mad though. A big reason I bought this rig was because of the rear locker.

 

[Hunner]

Find the wire coming out of the rear end for the locker.
Engage it and check that wire for power.

 

[4speedfunk]

Also the Eaton (factory GM) E-locker needs a few revolutions to fully engage. If you reverse, it will need another few revolutions to re-engage. Reversing does not shut it off...but it does disengage it, so you need to plan for 10-12 feet of forward travel before it will fully engage.

 

[LS12FAST4U]

Good to know about the GM locker. Thank you

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

Find the wire coming out of the rear end for the locker.
Engage it and check that wire for power.

no... the wire sends a reference current through the wire to determine 1) whether there's a open-circuit fault, and 2) to test for operation. If the light is solid, the differential is "locked" which makes the problem either the transfer case or the locker

To give a bit of encouragement, it's $500 plus $200 to install a new locker (give or take a few Cs)...

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

Also the Eaton (factory GM) E-locker needs a few revolutions to fully engage. If you reverse, it will need another few revolutions to re-engage. Reversing does not shut it off...but it does disengage it, so you need to plan for 10-12 feet of forward travel before it will fully engage.

you keep saying this, and I believe you, but it's not been my experience. Most times it'll lock up solid the moment I hit my switch... however, you've about a billion times more experience - so don't mind me.

 

[LS12FAST4U]

It's better then a grand but if it is indeed a problem with the locker then I will be pissed. I just bought the H3 a month ago. I changed the transfer case fluid and wow it was dirty. Good thing I changed it. I will report back after I have a chance to try out the locker again.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

put your vehicle on jack stands, into 4 low, engage the locker - both rear tires should turn in the same direction if the locker is okay.

 

[4speedfunk]

Read all about the Eaton here...
http://www.eaton.com/ecm/groups/public/@pub/@eaton/@per/documents/content/ct_128304.pdf

Factory H3 lockers are the "pin" type, and they have since been discontinued. If you buy an E-locker over the counter for your 8.6 GM...it will be the collar type. You can still get parts for the pin type, and they often need a rebuild kit. I assume this is why Eaton replaced them with the collar type...too many issues with the pins wearing out. Pin wear is most often a result of "gun-and-go" where the driver pushes the button and assumes the locker is immediately ready for some throttle. In reality it takes a rotation or two to fully engage...possibly more if the diff is in a bind (such as during a turn). The same thing happens if you reverse...the pins will climb out of their seats, and you need some forward travel (gently!) before they will be back in the fully-engaged position. Crash-locking the pins is a huge no-no, and once you take the flat surface off the ends of the pins...they will continue to get worse as they wear. Both collar-type and pin-type Eatons can be crash-locked but, the collar-types don't wear-out like the pin-type diffs do. As anyone who wheels knows...you don't always have the luxury of a straight path, ten feet before every obstacle! So, even if you read the instructions (which few people do)...its still quite easy to wear-out the pins inside the Eaton, if you get "locker-happy".

Regardless...I suspect your t-case from your original description. If you are in EITHER 4HI or 4LO locked...you should be spinning 50/50 (front & rear wheels)....with or without the locker.

 

[06 H3]

And on top that the eaton e locker disengages and re engages when going from forward to reverse so let's say you follow the instructions take a 10 foot line have it fully engaged and your line is off. You back up to fix your line you took it disengaged then has to re engage then the same going forward. It puts wear on it quickly

 

[Hunner]

Quote Originally Posted by Hunner View Post
Find the wire coming out of the rear end for the locker.
Engage it and check that wire for power.

no... the wire sends a reference current through the wire to determine 1) whether there's a open-circuit fault, and 2) to test for operation. If the light is solid, the differential is "locked" which makes the problem either the transfer case or the locker

To give a bit of encouragement, it's $500 plus $200 to install a new locker (give or take a few Cs)...

ANND, if it is sending that reference current it can be read with a multi-meter?
Indicating that not just the light is on but there is current going to the electro-magnet.

OR the Redneck technology is to raise all four wheels off the ground and see if the rears turn together?
NOT with the engine running!

There are only two wires that do the reference and actuate the electro-magnet.

Here is mine when the dealer tore it down WITHOUT checking for the reference current.

When I asked if they had done that I got that blank stare..............turns out there was a cut wire.

After they destroyed it taking it apart, the regional service rep told them to just put in a whole new one, they were trying to list all the parts which Eaton said, obviously they don't have a clue.

Only took them 6 weeks and had to borrow a tech from the Dodge place that had the knowledge.
I had GM re-imberse me for a month's car payment.






and for those that want to see, those little pins around the center need to have sharp or flat however you say that (like these)not rounded off ends, which would indicate cramming it to engage rather than gently nursing it to engage.



They engage in this part

 

[Hunner]

put your vehicle on jack stands, into 4 low, engage the locker - both rear tires should turn in the same direction if the locker is okay.

DO NOT DO THIS WITH IT RUNNING
and you should have all four wheels off the ground to allow things to move and to be safe!

Remember? This is all wheel drive according to the sticker under the hood of mine or you can call it full time four wheel drive if you want.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

or you can thumb through my build on my alpha and see how I completely eliminated the circuit and ran the lockers to a pair of switches. You cannot dead short the line because it'll come back as an error on the dash, you need to put a resistor that reduces the line voltage to 5% less... then the computer is wholly fooled. You can even accidentally turn the locker "on" (which it won't do because lines are cut) with the switch and all it will do is flash because it's only getting the reference voltage not a dead short

 

[LS12FAST4U]

Good information thank you. I'm hoping it's not the T case. Also as I mentioned before 4hi and 4Lo worked fine before I tried the locker so I'm leaning more towards a wire being cut in the diff. I would think if that was the case I would get the diff lock light only blinking and not staying lit but it does stay lit. Also I was told by the dealer that the H3 was a trade in and it was an older gentleman that owned it. Said it was never taken off road. If that's the case he probably never used the locker.

 

[RamRod]

The first time I went to use my lockers they didn't engage because the PO never used them... Tried the next and and they have worked ever since


Sent from handheld smoke signal device

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

Good information thank you. I'm hoping it's not the T case. Also as I mentioned before 4hi and 4Lo worked fine before I tried the locker so I'm leaning more towards a wire being cut in the diff. I would think if that was the case I would get the diff lock light only blinking and not staying lit but it does stay lit. Also I was told by the dealer that the H3 was a trade in and it was an older gentleman that owned it. Said it was never taken off road. If that's the case he probably never used the locker.

I'm an older gentleman (well, old anyway) and I beat the living snot out of my h3.... but I'm sure that the used-car-salesman would say the 1st half (which is a lie because I'm not a gentleman) and forget the 2nd half.

 

[LS12FAST4U]

Lol yeah I know how car salesman are. I actually sold cars for a little while haha. The H3 was in nice shape and looked like it was taken care of so I asked it if was a local trade or an auction vehicle. The salesman said local trade and that it was an older guy that drove it. Traded it in on a fusion I think he said. Anyway I know when the dealer gets it they detail it and clean under the hood so you can't tell anything that way but the skid plates looked good. No dents or scratches underneath so I took my chance.

 

[SuperBuickGuy]

Lol yeah I know how car salesman are. I actually sold cars for a little while haha. The H3 was in nice shape and looked like it was taken care of so I asked it if was a local trade or an auction vehicle. The salesman said local trade and that it was an older guy that drove it. Traded it in on a fusion I think he said. Anyway I know when the dealer gets it they detail it and clean under the hood so you can't tell anything that way but the skid plates looked good. No dents or scratches underneath so I took my chance.

I bought my H3 from a Toyota dealership, who told me that she bought a Prius.... I really don't like buying from idiots, but I made an exception this time because Alpha.

 

[Hunner]

I'm older and about to take back Social Security although it's not enough alone to take care of the H3! lol and there is not a mall within 20 miles.

I never offroad (much) I think those dents and scratches on the underside were from when they unloaded it off the auto carrier?

 

[4speedfunk]

Yeah...like the keel on a sailboat.